Brakes

Disclaimer.
The contents of this page are suggested solutions to members, to problems submitted by fellow members. Make sure you are competent to undertake changes and/or adjustments, and that you do not compromise the safety of any vehicle.

Subject:- ST1300 Rear Brakes

This question was asked by a member:-

Some weeks ago, I took my ST1300 (on a 54 plate) into my local Honda dealer for a service. I told the dealer to check the brakes and replace pads if necessary, which they did. Since then, I have been experiencing a rubbing sound and a vibration from the rear wheel when applying the rear brake in slow moving traffic. The bike has now been back to the dealer on three occasions to have the brakes checked and cleaned, needless to say, the problem has not gone away. They have now informed me that there is nothing wrong with the brake pads and it could be that the disc is shot. I was wondering if any other members had experienced the same problem and whether they had found a solution without replacing the rear disc.

These replies were submitted by members:-

1. I had the exact same problem with my '54 Pan. The problem was solved by fitting genuine Honda pads and not any other make (The make I had fitted escapes me at the moment). I was doing my advanced at the time, and the noise/rubbing feeling through the bike was awful. Hope this helps.

2. My pan is also on a '54 plate and I had same problem from new but I assumed it was because the brakes were bedding in, as it does not seem to effect anything except for the horrible noise. I clean my discs every week with brake/clutch cleaner but I still get the noise on odd occasions which I put down to the disc being dirty again. I do not know if this is the same as you or how to fix it but it sounds similar.

3. The cause should not be the discs, as the dealer should be able to determine if it is buckled or worn out etc. It possibly could be that the slave cylinder is not working properly, i.e. dirt in them possibly. The other alternative explanation is, if the noise is not constant when the wheel rotates, it may be that the pads have not be aligned (squarely to the disc). It also sounds as though you need a new dealer if they can't sort a simple thing like brakes.

4. Complex issue braking!! Are the correct pads fitted, are they genuine Honda? Brake pads are normally available as organic, semi-metallic and sintered. Organic pads contain no metallic parts; semi-metallic are a mixture of organic and metallic parts; and sintered metal pads are made completely from metal. Correspondingly the brake disk will be of a specific steel alloy to be compatible with the brake pad material. You can find out more at http://www.webbikeworld.com/motorcycle-brakes/ I recently fitted genuine Honda pads to the ST1300 (from David Silver) and have done 2000 miles plus since, without problems . Incidentally the front and rear pads for the ST1300 are the same. If you can make a cup of tea you can just as easily fit the pads (well almost).

Subject:- ST1100 ABS problem

This question was asked by a member:-

Hi, everyone. I'm hoping someone may be able to help me with an ABS fault on my W reg 1100 (TCS/ABS/CBS) The ABS warning light keeps flashing. I have done the fault code check(ignition on with ABS/TCS button pressed and counted the flashes-it varies from 20,10,30+ to none & even clears the fault without any input from me) I suspect the control unit itself is faulty but would appreciate any expert help I can get. Many thanks. Terry

These replies were submitted by members:-

1. Hi,
I’ve had a similar fault which was traced to a poor connection. Use the wiring diagram to trace back the cables to their various connectors. Clean up the connectors and spray with moisture repellent (eg WD40). It worked for me so good luck with yours.
Regards, Neil Hodgson

2. Hi terry
If Abs1 is off and Abs2 is flashing on move the book says either poor connection of white 16 pin ECU connector or burned out ABS main fuse (30A)
Hope it helps Keith

3. Terry, I have an M registered ST1100 ABS/TCS Pan (model AR) and the only faults I have had have been ABS related. If the fault can clear itself (intermittent) I would suggest a possible connection/contact dirty or getting moisture in. The most likely place this can happen is in the connection to the wheel sensors and I would recommend pulling both the back and front connectors apart, spraying with WD40 and make and break the contacts several times. If the warning only starts to flash in the first few meters when starting to move off (sensor checking mode) your fault is either in one of the sensors or the wiring. Even the Honda official manual doesn't tell you how to test the sensors themselves, even though they are to most vulnerable part of the whole system. A small piece of grit thrown up between the sensor and the toothed wheel (only 0.4 mm gap) will damage the sensor head. To test the sensor get a digital volt meter and attach some very thin wires to the probes then pass these down the rubber seal between the flying leads to the wheel sensors and the wiring loom and connect to the connectors inside. Then turn on the ignition and very very slowly turn the wheel. You should get a 4 volt signal when a tooth of the toothed ring is next to the sensor and 0 volt when next to a gap this should alternate as the wheel is turned. If it shows only 4 volts or 0 volts the sensor is faulty and will have to be replaced. Repeat with the other one. If you find a faulty sensor and you are handy with a soldering iron, identify the model number of TDK sensor printed on the side and get one from CPC or other electronic outlet then solder it to original wiring lead. Cost of TDK sensor about £20 if you get Honda part with lead attached you'll pay about £120. These prices were several years ago!
This information is from memory so I'll try and look up the full details and send them to you in the near future. I know what a pain ABS problems can be to find. I have recently had to change the front control unit on my AR variant (£450) and before I got the bike back on the road the rear control unit is showing a fault! The bike is rideable in that condition but won't pass an MOT! I'll be in touch again soon but if you sort it let me know how you get on. By the way I have photocopies of the Honda workshop manual covering ABS/TCS which includes the fault codes so I'll look those up for you.
Best wishes, Eric Hornby

4. Terry
I have read on a Pan forum website that sometimes, an ABS fault can be corrected by disconnecting the battery for a short period and than reconnecting it. It is a bit like rebooting a PC that locks up for no reason. The only other thing I can think of is that there may be a problem with the sensors on the wheels, I believe that that have to be set to a certain distance from the toothed ring, it is possible that the sensors may have been knocked out of position.
Getting more complicated, I understand that by following a certain procedure, the ABS lights can indicates a fault code which can help in diagnosing the fault. If powering down the bike does not work, I have attached part of the post '95 manual to this e-mail that might help you in diagnosing the fault. The procedure sounds complicated, I would be interested in knowing how you get on. (I have a 2002 ABS/TCS bike) Graham (NPR)

5. I had the same fault it was found to be the main fuse had corroded I cleaned contacts fitted new fuse. Hope this helps
Dave The Rock

6. Hi Terry,
Your message has been forwarded to me by Rich Suart.
Without seeing or testing the bike, it's very difficult to give an accurate diagnosis, but, with the symptoms you describe, I have to say that your suspicion seems to be right.
With such varying fault codes being shown, it is unlikely to be one fault occurring repeatedly.
As an outside chance, it might be worthwhile checking all connections to the control unit, including power and earth. Dodgy connections can cause a computer to go haywire.
If they all turn out to be OK, then regrettably, it would seem to be the control unit itself. I believe that the only cure is replacement, unless anybody else can come up with other information.
Sorry I can't be more positive, but I would be interested to hear the outcome.
Regards, Paul Horner, Pan Clan East Midlands

7. Hi Terry
2 things to check, first try cleaning the fuse for abs system, and fuse holder. I have had this problem and it was a corroded fuse. Also ensure battery fully charged. If neither helps try starting bike on centre stand and see if any different, this will check the bank angle sensor in modules.
Derek

8. Hi Terry
My bike is the same model as yours. When I bought it off ebay the seller said that the ABS light was staying on and it had a piece of insulating tape stuck over it.
I took it to my local mechanic who tested it and it was doing similar things to yours. He sussed it out that it was the rear modulator and rear wheel speed sensor. A previous owner had tried to remove the modulater assembly and sheared a bolt off the bottom of housing. They then tried to fix it by taping it up with insulating tape but it would not work as I think it works on pressure when the brake is applied.
A new unit is horrendous to buy £800ish I think at the time from David Silver then silly money for the speed sensor. Got one from a breakers eventually, but still cost me nearly £200.
The front wheel also has its own unit and speed sensor as well.
The original fault on mine was the speed sensor on the rear wheel but the owner tried to remove the modulator instead and caused the damage.
There is a quick way of checking if it is either modulators or sensors but I can't remember how it was done.
If you ring 0151 637 2221 (Hondatech) and ask for Paul, tell him you were speaking to me (Phil from Wirral Advanced Motorcyclists) with your problem and he will explain to you over the telephone how to do it. If you live localish then take it to him at 65a Martins Lane, Wallasey and he will test it for you. It only takes him 5 mins.
He does not open up 'til 10:30 and is a 1 man operation so can take ages for him to answer the telephone.
Bit long winded, but hope this helps.
Good Luck
p.s. if you need pics of the parts I will email them to you.

	Disclaimer. The contents of this page are suggested solutions to members, to problems submitted by fellow members. Make sure you are competent to undertake changes and/or adjustments, and that you do not compromise the safety of any vehicle.
Subject:- ST1300 Rear Brakes
This question was asked by a member:- Some weeks ago, I took my ST1300 (on a 54 plate) into my local Honda dealer for a service. I told the dealer to check the brakes and replace pads if necessary, which they did. Since then, I have been experiencing a rubbing sound and a vibration from the rear wheel when applying the rear brake in slow moving traffic. The bike has now been back to the dealer on three occasions to have the brakes checked and cleaned, needless to say, the problem has not gone away. They have now informed me that there is nothing wrong with the brake pads and it could be that the disc is shot. I was wondering if any other members had experienced the same problem and whether they had found a solution without replacing the rear disc.		These replies were submitted by members:- 1. I had the exact same problem with my '54 Pan. The problem was solved by fitting genuine Honda pads and not any other make (The make I had fitted escapes me at the moment). I was doing my advanced at the time, and the noise/rubbing feeling through the bike was awful. Hope this helps. 2. My pan is also on a '54 plate and I had same problem from new but I assumed it was because the brakes were bedding in, as it does not seem to effect anything except for the horrible noise. I clean my discs every week with brake/clutch cleaner but I still get the noise on odd occasions which I put down to the disc being dirty again. I do not know if this is the same as you or how to fix it but it sounds similar. 3. The cause should not be the discs, as the dealer should be able to determine if it is buckled or worn out etc. It possibly could be that the slave cylinder is not working properly, i.e. dirt in them possibly. The other alternative explanation is, if the noise is not constant when the wheel rotates, it may be that the pads have not be aligned (squarely to the disc). It also sounds as though you need a new dealer if they can't sort a simple thing like brakes. 4. Complex issue braking!! Are the correct pads fitted, are they genuine Honda? Brake pads are normally available as organic, semi-metallic and sintered. Organic pads contain no metallic parts; semi-metallic are a mixture of organic and metallic parts; and sintered metal pads are made completely from metal. Correspondingly the brake disk will be of a specific steel alloy to be compatible with the brake pad material. You can find out more at http://www.webbikeworld.com/motorcycle-brakes/ I recently fitted genuine Honda pads to the ST1300 (from David Silver) and have done 2000 miles plus since, without problems . Incidentally the front and rear pads for the ST1300 are the same. If you can make a cup of tea you can just as easily fit the pads (well almost).
Subject:- ST1100 ABS problem
This question was asked by a member:- Hi, everyone. I'm hoping someone may be able to help me with an ABS fault on my W reg 1100 (TCS/ABS/CBS) The ABS warning light keeps flashing. I have done the fault code check(ignition on with ABS/TCS button pressed and counted the flashes-it varies from 20,10,30+ to none & even clears the fault without any input from me) I suspect the control unit itself is faulty but would appreciate any expert help I can get. Many thanks. Terry		These replies were submitted by members:- 1. Hi, I’ve had a similar fault which was traced to a poor connection. Use the wiring diagram to trace back the cables to their various connectors. Clean up the connectors and spray with moisture repellent (eg WD40). It worked for me so good luck with yours. Regards, Neil Hodgson 2. Hi terry If Abs1 is off and Abs2 is flashing on move the book says either poor connection of white 16 pin ECU connector or burned out ABS main fuse (30A) Hope it helps Keith 3. Terry, I have an M registered ST1100 ABS/TCS Pan (model AR) and the only faults I have had have been ABS related. If the fault can clear itself (intermittent) I would suggest a possible connection/contact dirty or getting moisture in. The most likely place this can happen is in the connection to the wheel sensors and I would recommend pulling both the back and front connectors apart, spraying with WD40 and make and break the contacts several times. If the warning only starts to flash in the first few meters when starting to move off (sensor checking mode) your fault is either in one of the sensors or the wiring. Even the Honda official manual doesn't tell you how to test the sensors themselves, even though they are to most vulnerable part of the whole system. A small piece of grit thrown up between the sensor and the toothed wheel (only 0.4 mm gap) will damage the sensor head. To test the sensor get a digital volt meter and attach some very thin wires to the probes then pass these down the rubber seal between the flying leads to the wheel sensors and the wiring loom and connect to the connectors inside. Then turn on the ignition and very very slowly turn the wheel. You should get a 4 volt signal when a tooth of the toothed ring is next to the sensor and 0 volt when next to a gap this should alternate as the wheel is turned. If it shows only 4 volts or 0 volts the sensor is faulty and will have to be replaced. Repeat with the other one. If you find a faulty sensor and you are handy with a soldering iron, identify the model number of TDK sensor printed on the side and get one from CPC or other electronic outlet then solder it to original wiring lead. Cost of TDK sensor about £20 if you get Honda part with lead attached you'll pay about £120. These prices were several years ago! This information is from memory so I'll try and look up the full details and send them to you in the near future. I know what a pain ABS problems can be to find. I have recently had to change the front control unit on my AR variant (£450) and before I got the bike back on the road the rear control unit is showing a fault! The bike is rideable in that condition but won't pass an MOT! I'll be in touch again soon but if you sort it let me know how you get on. By the way I have photocopies of the Honda workshop manual covering ABS/TCS which includes the fault codes so I'll look those up for you. Best wishes, Eric Hornby 4. Terry I have read on a Pan forum website that sometimes, an ABS fault can be corrected by disconnecting the battery for a short period and than reconnecting it. It is a bit like rebooting a PC that locks up for no reason. The only other thing I can think of is that there may be a problem with the sensors on the wheels, I believe that that have to be set to a certain distance from the toothed ring, it is possible that the sensors may have been knocked out of position. Getting more complicated, I understand that by following a certain procedure, the ABS lights can indicates a fault code which can help in diagnosing the fault. If powering down the bike does not work, I have attached part of the post '95 manual to this e-mail that might help you in diagnosing the fault. The procedure sounds complicated, I would be interested in knowing how you get on. (I have a 2002 ABS/TCS bike) Graham (NPR) 5. I had the same fault it was found to be the main fuse had corroded I cleaned contacts fitted new fuse. Hope this helps Dave The Rock 6. Hi Terry, Your message has been forwarded to me by Rich Suart. Without seeing or testing the bike, it's very difficult to give an accurate diagnosis, but, with the symptoms you describe, I have to say that your suspicion seems to be right. With such varying fault codes being shown, it is unlikely to be one fault occurring repeatedly. As an outside chance, it might be worthwhile checking all connections to the control unit, including power and earth. Dodgy connections can cause a computer to go haywire. If they all turn out to be OK, then regrettably, it would seem to be the control unit itself. I believe that the only cure is replacement, unless anybody else can come up with other information. Sorry I can't be more positive, but I would be interested to hear the outcome. Regards, Paul Horner, Pan Clan East Midlands 7. Hi Terry 2 things to check, first try cleaning the fuse for abs system, and fuse holder. I have had this problem and it was a corroded fuse. Also ensure battery fully charged. If neither helps try starting bike on centre stand and see if any different, this will check the bank angle sensor in modules. Derek 8. Hi Terry My bike is the same model as yours. When I bought it off ebay the seller said that the ABS light was staying on and it had a piece of insulating tape stuck over it. I took it to my local mechanic who tested it and it was doing similar things to yours. He sussed it out that it was the rear modulator and rear wheel speed sensor. A previous owner had tried to remove the modulater assembly and sheared a bolt off the bottom of housing. They then tried to fix it by taping it up with insulating tape but it would not work as I think it works on pressure when the brake is applied. A new unit is horrendous to buy £800ish I think at the time from David Silver then silly money for the speed sensor. Got one from a breakers eventually, but still cost me nearly £200. The front wheel also has its own unit and speed sensor as well. The original fault on mine was the speed sensor on the rear wheel but the owner tried to remove the modulator instead and caused the damage. There is a quick way of checking if it is either modulators or sensors but I can't remember how it was done. If you ring 0151 637 2221 (Hondatech) and ask for Paul, tell him you were speaking to me (Phil from Wirral Advanced Motorcyclists) with your problem and he will explain to you over the telephone how to do it. If you live localish then take it to him at 65a Martins Lane, Wallasey and he will test it for you. It only takes him 5 mins. He does not open up 'til 10:30 and is a 1 man operation so can take ages for him to answer the telephone. Bit long winded, but hope this helps. Good Luck p.s. if you need pics of the parts I will email them to you.

Brakes

Disclaimer. The contents of this page are suggested solutions to members, to problems submitted by fellow members. Make sure you are competent to undertake changes and/or adjustments, and that you do not compromise the safety of any vehicle.

Subject:- ST1300 Rear Brakes

This question was asked by a member:-

These replies were submitted by members:-

Subject:- ST1100 ABS problem

Disclaimer.
The contents of this page are suggested solutions to members, to problems submitted by fellow members. Make sure you are competent to undertake changes and/or adjustments, and that you do not compromise the safety of any vehicle.